Subject: SMML VOL 1501 Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2002 11:59:33 +1100 shipmodels@tac.com.au -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS INDEX 1: Carrier deck markings 2: Thresher /Permit 3: Re: Scorpion/Thresher/Permit 4: USS Nautilus SSN-571 5: Re: Plane colors on USS LANGLEY 6: Freebies 7: Nice Web sites 8: USS NEW JERSEY 9: Re: DD-936 Barry 10: How many of us are there? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD INDEX 1: Okay here Goes! 2: Re: WWII USS Tracy - DM-19 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MODELLERS -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: O'Connor Subject: Carrier deck markings Peter- You told us of using rub-on transfers for deck markings. My experience with them has always ended with curved, wiggly lines. How do you get them straight?? I tried taping them, but as you burnish them down, they seem to stretch some, and it causes distortion. Any suggestions? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: "John Sheridan" Subject: Thresher /Permit >> About the THRESHER-PERMIT class question( forgot it on the last entry) What if any cosmetic changes were made to the class (THRESHER/PERMIT) after the THRESHER's loss? << There are no differences between the classes. The Navy sometimes will change the class name if the lead ship is lost. Of course, as the years go on changes will be made so the follow-ons no longer look like the original. >> I am considering purchasing a PERMIT class kit from Blue Water Navy. It looks like an excelant starter resin kit. Does anybody have any firsthand info on this kit they would like to share with me? Feel free to E-mail me if you think this string is taking up to much time and space. << All of the BWN submarine kits are excellent starter kits for those wishing to cut their teeth on resin kits. The only real tip I can give you concerning the BWN sub kits is to drill small holes in the dive planes and periscopes and insert some pins. This will really help when it comes to attaching these parts to the hull and add strength to the part. Also, you will find there will be small gaps once you attach these parts to the hull. To fix this, use some slightly diluted Elmers glue to fill the seam. Once you fill the seam, remove the excess with a Q-tip dipped in water. This will help smooth out the fill and help the overall finish. You can see photos of my BWN USS Thresher kit (and others) at: http://www.steelnavy.com/gallery_submarines.htm I will be adding a in-box review of the Thresher kit in about a week on the Steelnavy.com website. John Sheridan -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: Re: Scorpion/Thresher/Permit >> About the THRESHER-PERMIT class question( forgot it on the last entry) What if any cosmetic changes were made to the class (THRESHER/PERMIT) after the THRESHER's loss? I am considering purchasing a PERMIT class kit from Blue Water Navy. It looks like an excelant starter resin kit. Does anybody have any firsthand info on this kit they would like to share with me? << BWN kits are generally very good; I have several, but do not have the Permit kit from them. There is usually a big pour plug that you have to carefully remove from the bottom of the hull. At present, these are the only kits of the Permit class available (at present....). Most changes to the Permti class were internal, the most significant being to the ballast/blow system and the routing and diameter of the HP air lines. Venturi cooling and ice buildup in the long runs of HP air line were felt to be contributors to the loss of Thresher. This effect was demonstrated dockside in a a test with another of the Permit class. Keep in mind that the Thresher class was the first of the deep divers, with roughly twice the test depth (reported in open sources to be about 1300 ft) of previous classes of post WWII subs (Skipjack, Skate , Nautilus/Seawolf and the diesel Tangs) of 700 ft. Thus air pressures necessary to empty the ballast tanks were much higher than those used in the earlier boats. Effects not seen at lower pressures in the water vapor-saturated air systems of the Thresher class, such as venturi effect induced icing, became significant. An effort was made to reduce the number of through hull fittings to a minimum, as this was also felt to be a contributor to the flooding and subsequent reactor shut down. At one point, there was a plan to use an external water "scoop" to route seawater into the reactor at low speeds for cooling, to allow pumps to be shutdown at low speeds to reduce noise sources. As a result, this was only implemented in the test bed natural water circulation reactor of Narwhal (SSN-671). Many Soviet submarine classes were reported to have this feature. During their lifetime, various sonar domes and other appendages appeared on Permits and Sturgeons, so it might be best to get photos of the particular sub and time period. Some Permits such as Jack, launched just 14 days after Thresher's loss, had unusual features and dimensions. Jack had twin contra-rotating propellers and was 296 ft in length vs. 278 ft for others of her class. As an example, here is a great drydock shot of her twin screws along with a communications "bustle" dome near her stern at: http://www.uss-jack.org/ssnindex.html Ahhh, but where do I find these? I always start at the Ron Martini Submarine World Network Page. Look under "Fleet", where many submarine home pages of all classes are featured. http://www.rontini.com/ I also have (seriously) about 8-9 linear feet of book shelf full of submarine books and references. When questions are asked, I usually go there for material to post these long-winded replies. But that's what this whole SMML venture is all about- Sharing! Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: USS Nautilus SSN-571 FYI- The Museum ship Nautilus, usually berthed at the US Naval Submarine Base's Submarine Force Museum in Groton, CT, has been towed to General Dynamic's Electric Boat for drydocking. The submarine will undergo scraping, painting and some deck and sail work before returning to the museum in late May 2002. Just thought I would pass along the heads up in case anyone was planning to visit the area in the next few months. The museum is still open, sans Nautilus. On a related topic, I have been contacted to do some model work at the same Submarine Force Museum on a large cut-through interior 688 model. Hot Damn! Also, I did ask the Naval Officer who is the current museum director whether there was any truth to the rumor that NavSea Systems Command had given the OK to open up the Nautilus' propulsion spaces for the public tour. Sadly, no, according to him. The reactor and associated systems, BTW, is long gone; removed in the early 80's in Washington state before she was towed to Connecticut. Tom Dougherty -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5) From: AAA Hobby Subject: Re: Plane colors on USS LANGLEY >> Two questions :What does C&R mean? Also would spar varnish be polyurvane? << C&R would be the Naval Bureau of Construction & Repair under most uses. I am not sure when polyurethane varishes first appeared, but I seem to have a kernel of knowledge that Pop. Mech. had a "flashback" item from the 1950s for this. Just a guess/hunch. James Corley AAA Hobby Supply email: aaahobby@earthlink.net -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Freebies For great Navy screen savers goto. http://www.messdecks.com/frescreen.html Shaya Novak Naval Base Hobbies The Store for The Model Ship Builder www.modelshipbuilding.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7) From: URUDOFSKY@aol.com Subject: Nice Web sites Here are two websites that not be generally known: http://www.dockmuseum.org.uk:8180/barrow/redirect?r=html/indexCats.htm http://thoschmid2.bei.t-online.de/page_images/hood/ Ulrich Rudofsky -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) From: IAAFru2@aol.com Subject: USS NEW JERSEY Hi list, I am modeling a 1:350 NJ from the Tamiya Missouri kit, and I will be scratch building the mast on the aft stack, and have received valuable help from several members on this list, thanks for that, My Question is this dose any one make a kit that might contain the SC height finder that goes on the top of that mast? Or maybe I've got the wrong name for it, it is the part that looks like a small Satellite Dish, on the mast on the rear stack. I don't feel real confident in trying to build one, so I am hopping that maybe someone make an after market kit which contains this part. Any help you could give is appreciated. Thanks George -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9) From: "Robert Burgerhout" Subject: Re: DD-936 Barry The USS Barry (DD936) recieved in 1959 the SQS-23 bow sonar. Therefor the ship got a clipperbow, adding 7 ft to the oa-lenght (from 418 to 425 ft.) ASW Modernization: FY 64, SCB 251 (all other ships SBC221). Conversion started 1 may 1967 at the Boston NY. recommissioned 19 April 1968. Modernization data: - 2 twin 3"/50 removerd, forward replaced by a deckhouse (magazine for 12 torpedoes) - #2 5" gun replaced by an ASROC Mk 16 launcher (a little bit forward) - bridge enclosed - deckhouse added between the funnels - part of the maindeck enclosed - forward radarmast's capacity increased - 2 triple ASW TT Mk32 on either side of the new magazine - IVDS SQS-35 added aft. The ship was decommissioned on 5 November 1982. In 1983 to Washington Robert -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10) From: Ives100@aol.com Subject: How many of us are there? A quick question for our listmaster, Shane. While answering some queries today for SMML, my wife asked me, "How many people receive the list mailings?" Good question! What is our current circulation, please? Thanks, Tom Dougherty Hi Tom, There are approx 1200 people on SMML. Regards, Shane -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- TRADERS, ANNOUNCEMENTS & NOTICEBOARD -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) From: "Shaya Novak" Subject: Okay here Goes! Please don't think for one second I'm complaining. Yes I have a job in another state NJ that moved from NYC where I live. I get up at 4:30am look to see how things are at NBH, by 5:30am I'm at the post office to drop off orders going out I have a good relationship with the PO. At 6:00am I go to religious services. I get on a subway at 6:50am that gets me to Manhattan then a bus to NJ. I get to work by 9:00am. I have the leisure of being able to do some of my NBH business at work because I'm a boss. I get back on a bus head back home get there by 7:15pm. Eat supper and am at the NBH by 8:00pm downstairs in my house. I run the show by myself till 12:00 to 12:30am. Go to bed and get up at 4:30am. You might say why don't I do this during the day full time. Well as some of you know I had a store in Manhattan for 2yrs. but I couldn't make it on just ships alone. There is only ONE true hobby store in all of Manhattan for a city of 10 million people that go in and out everyday. With a mortgage 3 kids in college ships don't make. I have a tremedous amount a of medical bills on top of my insurance. But I love the hobby so much I keep at. I do all of my website myself. You look at my website you will see it is much different than most hobby sites. I have so much background about the ships plus modeling tips, I have customers that go there just to get info. Take a look at my "NavalLinks" page. Look at the info I have on the American ship pages. I work NBH on weekends too. I will put something up that says about how long. My achilles heel is PE and Decals this is where I get stuck the most. PS I haven't built a ship my true love in about 3 years no time running NBH. That's all folks. Shaya Novak Naval Base Hobbies The Store for The Model Ship Builder www.modelshipbuilding.com PS: As recommened I have added a beware sign to my PE and Decal pages. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2) From: John Snyder Subject: Re: WWII USS Tracy - DM-19 Hi Henry, Note that we have a 1/350 kit of USS REUBEN JAMES, one of TRACY's sister ships (though not configured as a DM). You could build a TRACY from her, with a little research regarding the minelaying gear. Best, John Snyder White Ensign Models http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/white.ensign.models -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Check out the SMML site for the List Rules, Backissues, Member's models & reference pictures at: http://smmlonline.com Check out the APMA site for an index of ship articles in the Reference section at: http://apma.org.au/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Volume